In a world buzzing with AI advancements, we often hear about the incredible productivity gains this tech promises. But what if we're focusing on the wrong metric? In this enlightening conversation with Dave Jimison, co-founder and director of innovation at NullWest, we explore a more nuanced approach to evaluating AI's impact on our work and lives.

Stephanie Pereira from Astral sat down with Dave, a true pioneer at the intersection of AI and human creativity, to discuss how we can move beyond simple efficiency metrics and unlock AI's potential to enhance human ingenuity, foster accessibility, and even redefine our concept of work itself.

Listen to the full episode to dive deeper into Dave's insights on human-AI collaboration, unexpected AI applications, and how to retain a sense of play in our increasingly AI-driven world.

Tune into the full 20-minute conversation here.

Key Topics

00:00 - Redefining productivity in the context of AI

02:54 - Human-in-the-loop systems: Definition and real-world examples

04:49 - Meaningful human-AI collaboration and ethical considerations

08:49 - Unexpected possibilities of AI: Accessibility and personalization

11:09 - Dave's playbook for identifying transformative AI opportunities

14:31 - Liberty as a new metric for AI impact and productivity

17:09 - Personal AI applications: Scaffolding and mobile note-taking

19:13 - Retaining a sense of play with AI in organizations

"Humans are really good at divergent thinking, and this [human in the loop] process helps shake up the models around AI." — Dave Jimison, NullWest

Q&A

Stephanie: You mentioned in a recent provocative post, that productivity is the wrong metric. What metrics should we be using to evaluate AI's real impact?

Dave: When we use the term "productivity," we're referencing a lot of things that if we stop at productivity, we're missing some of the nuance. I think we can pull out more nuance from this term and consider what it means to have one engineer do the work of 10. What's the mental strain on that? What are the labor aspects we're missing?

More importantly, businesses are saying that with productivity, we can accomplish other goals. Our engineers can get more sleep, be happier, stay longer, have less turnover, or we can have new offerings. We can dedicate more time and resources to R&D, and develop entirely new products.

By moving that metric from productivity as a buzzword to more applied terminology, you're able to really unpack the way that AI is actually benefiting your company.

Stephanie: For organizations wrestling with ethical concerns about AI, what does meaningful human-AI collaboration actually look like in practice?

Dave: I don't have a great answer or product that solves ethics, unfortunately, but I do think that giving your humans agency to be involved is going to benefit everyone. People who have been working in a career for ten or twenty years have a lot to add, and they want to feel like they're part of the transformation. This approach will go a long way in terms of developing a better and more competitive product.

Even if you eventually have to reduce staff (unfortunately), you're helping them feel like they are part of a new transformation or enabling them to potentially find other jobs. At NullWest, we focus on AI advocacy and training for the overall staff of companies, which I find to be a really important part of the process.

Stephanie: What unexpected possibilities do you think we're not yet seeing with AI because of the over-focus on efficiency or productivity?

Dave: One area I'm really excited about is Accessibility. We can now use generative AI to produce content in different formats for people with various needs. Accessibility is not just for the visually impaired, as we often think about in early ADA compliance, but it also has to do with cognitive impairment, which we're going to see a lot more of in our aging population.

Imagine AI that's no longer producing static websites where everybody has to consume the same material, but is able to take in the unique capabilities of the viewer and reorganize that information for them? Once we start to do that for accessibility, I think we'll start to see it actually play out for the end consumer as well.

Stephanie: What's your playbook for helping clients see past immediate efficiency gains to identify truly transformative AI opportunities?

Dave: It starts with core desires, working through and elucidating what those core desires are. Then, I like to use UX prototyping tools like Wizard of Oz, where you prototype things with a "human in the loop" to play out capabilities.

Finally, I use open-ended play in workshops to let clients experiment and see what emerges. Humans are really good at divergent thinking, and this process helps shake up the models around AI. It's vital that clients grasp what AI is and how it works so they can better communicate their vision for its implementation.

Stephanie: What is your number one tip for the Astral audience on how to make the most of AI to empower their creativity and enable them to focus on more meaningful work?

Dave: I think retaining a sense of play with AI and really trying to get your whole organization to engage in that together, whether it's just a hackathon or asking people to show cool things in conversations. It really opens a lot of doors to potential, and it's bringing some of the concerns that might be going on out into the open as well as creating new opportunities.

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Want to hear more about Dave's insights on AI, creativity, and the future of work? Listen to the full episode for a deeper dive into these fascinating topics and more unexpected revelations about the potential of AI in our lives and businesses.

Tune in here on YouTube.